With a career spanning over 25 years, Jennifer Esposito is no stranger to the ups and downs of Hollywood. Over the years, she has established herself as a force to be reckoned with, appearing in over 60 films, including the Academy Award-winning “Crash” by Paul Haggis, Spike Lee’s “Summer of Sam,” and “Welcome to Collinwood” by the Russo Brothers. And let’s not forget how she’s lit up the screen on TV shows like “Spin City,” “Blue Bloods,” “The Boys,” and “Nora From Queens.” Her passion for acting and dedication to her craft are unparalleled, earning her accolades from the Screen Actors Guild, Critics Choice, and Hollywood Foreign Press. Even with all her success, she knew there was another chapter in her story yet to be written, so she picked up the pen. Flash forward to the summer of 2024, when her vision would finally become a reality.
The driving force behind “Fresh Kills,” Esposito takes on four roles—starring, directing, writing, and producing—in her feature directorial debut. A beautifully nuanced and hard-hitting drama, the film turns the classic mob movie inside out, following two teenage girls living in a mafia world filled with violence, fear, and rage. It’s a closed-off world that dictates who these young women are destined to become… unless they fight to break free. The “Fresh Kills” ensemble cast includes “Paranormal Activity: Next of Kin”’s Emily Bader as Rose, “Hellraiser”’s Odessa A’zion as Connie, “Tulsa King”’s Domenick Lombardozzi as Joe, along with Annabella Sciorra, Nicholas Cirillo, Stelio Savante, and Franco Maicas. The results of Esposito’s tireless efforts speak for themselves, as the intense drama lingers long after the credits roll, proving it has both heart and soul.
Jason Price of Icon Vs. Icon recently caught up with Jennifer Esposito to discuss the challenges of bringing her creative vision from script to screen. Along the way, she offers an inside look into the making of her directorial debut, one of 2024’s most powerful films, and provides insight into the current state of indie filmmaking and distribution.
You’ve become such a familiar face in film and television. How did your creative journey begin?
The journey began when I was placed in front of a TV at a very young age. I was watching things like “Grease” and “West Side Story.” It was magic! I knew that whatever they were doing, I knew that was what I wanted to do! I always said what acting I wanted to do because I didn’t know anything about filmmaking as a kid. We didn’t hear anything about that kind of thing. I did know that I wanted to go to NYU to study film. So, there was an inkling there of “I want to know the whole thing. I want to know all of it!” I couldn’t afford to go to NYU, so I put myself through the Lee Strasberg Theater Institute and did the acting thing, but I always felt like something was missing. It was never the fulfillment that I thought it would be or wanted. Certain roles felt full, but I just felt like something was missing. At the same time, I did have stories floating in my head for a long time, especially “Fresh Kills,” because I grew up around it. I pitched it throughout my career, and people would tell me it was a great idea. Every actor has a story like that where they have an idea and hear, “Oh, yeah! That’s great. Just go do it!” It was that type of dismissal. I just got to a point where I was so soul-crushed and done with the stuff I saw for myself and then not seeing it all. I was also done with complaining about what I was seeing just on my screen for females in movies in general. I thought, “Stop complaining. No one cares. No one cares. No one’s listening. No one cares. No one will believe in you to do your idea or help you write it. No one will call one day and say that things have changed. The industry has not changed. Go do it.” That was seven years ago when I got serious about it. I had started writing this many times. Finally, I sat down and said, “I’m not getting up until I finish!”
You’ve got a fantastic work ethic. How did that end up in your creative DNA?
I was dropped off at a movie theater at 13. My mother said, “Go get a job! “She just believed you need to know how to work and care for yourself. My dad was the same way and said, “Pay for your books at school.” So, I had to do that at an early age. That’s the thing! I’m not afraid of work! I’m okay working, especially if it’s something that I believe I’m good at. So, now people say, “Oh, it must have been so hard wearing all the hats.” That was the beauty of it. I loved it! Writing and making the film was fantastic. It’s dealing with the business side of things that’s not fantastic. That’s a whole other thing! Wearing all those has and seeing it through to fruition to have you created in your head come to life, nothing beats it.
What were some of the lessons that you learned early in the business impacted your view moving forward?
Oh, my God! There’s so much. When I entered the business, I thought it was all about art and creativity. You realize very quickly. It may have taken me a little longer to realize that, but you realize it’s a business. First and foremost, it’s a business. You realize it’s less about talent and more about who you know, relationships, and everything else. Years later, I’m still learning. This whole experience has been so insane! I still learn and get and get shocked. It’s as savvy and street-smart as it feels like I am; I still am a bit naïve. Well, maybe not naive, maybe wishful in thinking that the saying, “It has to be undeniable…” is true. It is actually not true, and that was hard to swallow. So yeah, I’ve learned a lot throughout my career and am still learning!
At the root of what you do, you are a storyteller. When do you feel you came into your own in that capacity?
I always did that, and no one wanted me to do that. You would get a character, and it’s not fully fleshed out because it’s the second, third, or fourth from the lead, and it is a female! So sometimes the character isn’t fully fleshed out. So, I have been doing this to a certain extent, like you said. “Fresh Kills” was so fulfilling because I could put everything together. All of it! I did have a fantastic teacher, George Loris, at the Lee Strasberg Theater Institute, who used to make us read psychology books. That’s something that I talk about when I teach. I always talk about that because it is such an important aspect of this work to understand why people do what they do. That is why I love being able to tell the whole story: You can ride the wave of these characters and really understand why they do what they do. That’s really what excites me about this work!
Let’s jump into “Fresh Kills.” Tell us about the initial spark for this film and how the ball got rolling.
While my family wasn’t involved, the families around us were. The young women that I grew up with were daughters of some very big guys, and the violence and rage that I saw from them were pretty incredible. I was always running from them or around it enough to see what was happening. That always stuck with me, and that’s where the idea started. The idea for me was, “Why are they so angry?” And I would say, “Well, if my father was in the mafia, maybe I’d be really angry too.” I realized as I got out into the world and further into my career that it was more so because I, too, started feeling this rage. It was more about being stuck in a spot or born into a slot that you could not get out of. It was something I related to being female, being in the ceiling, and having a ceiling as a female, with age, ethnicity — all of it. So that’s where the foundation of “Fresh Kills” really is. It really has nothing to do with the Mafia. It has more to do with finding a voice in a world that tells you to shut up.
You mentioned revisiting this project multiple times over the years. Take us back to the time in your life when you finally put the pedal to the floor.
I remember that it was around New Year’s. I was really, really unhappy with where things were for me in my career, and I just felt so thrown away by an industry. I was not seeing anything come in, and I just got tired of hearing myself complain. I didn’t like being in such a space of powerlessness. That’s how many actors feel, powerless because we can’t go out and just act on the street! [laughs] You have to get hired, whereas a writer could write. As a writer, you want to make that thing, but you can still do your thing. I felt that powerful position. I realized that nobody but me could stop me from picking up the pen. So, I picked up the pen!
That was the moment that led me to do this. I was like, “No, no. You have a story. You keep saying you could do it to yourself. Then do it.” Once you’ve looked yourself in the face, you’re like, “Oh shit, now I have to do it!” Of course, you still question yourself, “Oh no, can I do it?” You definitely do. Even after all I’ve experienced, I still do that now, do that.” The question has become, “Can you do this again?”
And, you know, there is a part of me that is afraid, but then the other part is like, “Fuck Yeah, you can do it again!” You know, there’s a little PTSD now! [laughs] There’s a lot of trauma now, so it’s a little like, “Are you insane?” Yes! [laughs] So yeah, I go back and forth, but the first time was just so pure. I wanted to feel like my life was in my own hands. As an actor, your life just isn’t in your hands. You can ask any actor you want to book a job with or plan a trip with! The second you plan a trip, you book a job and you’ll find yourself saying, “Sorry, people, family, and friends. I have to go over here and move to Toronto for six years!” You don’t really have a voice as an actor, especially as a female actor, unless you get to a certain level where you can actually call the shots. However, the majority of females don’t have that. That was another element of this that I really needed.
I’m sure the struggle to get there made your first day on set all the more sweet. What do you recall about that day? I’m sure tensions were high. I can only imagine what you’re going through.
You’re right! I was on such a wild ride because it was so ridiculously hard to get to that point, ridiculously hard. When we finally reached that point, my adrenaline kicked me into gear. Everything was ramping up, and we were finally there. It got to the point where we were about to do the first shot, and I was supposed to call action. I swear, I had a moment of “What the hell did I do? Can I do this?” The first AD asked me, “Do you want me to call action?” And I said, “Yeah, maybe you should call action.” Because I was like, [whispers] “Action, action.” I was so not present for a moment. I just remember thinking, “You mortgaged your house for this. What are you doing? Can you do this?” It really hit me right in the face at that moment.
I remember looking at the shot and then looking at the monitor. I remember feeling like, “This is a classic movie.” I thought, “Oh, I’ve seen this; this is going to go down. Yep! That’s what that looks like to me.” I don’t know why, but in that moment, I was like, “Okay, I’ve got this. I can do this.” It was so strange. It was the scene where Rose is in bed when she wakes up at the beginning of the third act, where she’s in the big pink dress. She wakes up and is just in that big pink dress in this teal room. And I was just like, “That’s it!” I’ve been thinking of Rose for 20 years. The character of Rose was initially written for me. Seeing that first shot, I knew, “That’s Rose! She’s here. I’ve been talking to her for 20 years, and she’s here.” It was a crazy moment and one I’ll never forget.
How did the story in the script evolve over time?
There were huge changes because I have changed. “Fresh Kills” would have been a very different story if I had made it 10 or 20 years ago. It would have been a very different story, and the depth comes from who I am today and the things I’ve seen. So often hear people say, “Oh, it’s a mafia story.” I get it. It’s in that genre, but it’s not really about the Mafia. So, I don’t know if that underlying story would have been there as deeply as it is if I had written it earlier. The story that was always in this structure was that I always knew certain things would happen, but how I got there was definitely a different journey. It changed because of the changes I have experienced throughout my life.
The film’s cast is terrific, and I’m not overselling it.
Thank you!
You’re welcome, and I mean it wholeheartedly. This is one of those stories that stays with you long after you leave the theater. That’s a rarity in how so many films feel way more homogenized than raw or authentic. I can’t wait to see what they do next.
Yes! You definitely will because those girls are taking off! My promise to myself, once the script was done, was to take one step forward each day, whether that meant giving it to a friend to read or giving it to someone for suggestions on what they thought, so that’s what I did! One day, I gave it to a friend of mine, Alicia Coppola, who is also an actor. She called me immediately and said, “I know who Connie is.” I was like, “You do? Who?!” That role really scared me, because, when it comes to the girls I grew up with, you can’t act this kind of shit! They’re frightening. Absolutely frightening. It’s not this is not like girls fighting. This is like the rage of a young woman that we don’t see. So, I was very scared about who could fill the role.
Alicia goes, “I found her. I’m telling you, I found her!” She told me to watch a show she did on Netflix for only one season. I sat down to watch an episode, and before I knew it, I watched the whole season! When I saw Emily Bader in that, I was like, “Yup! That’s her. That’s definitely her.” I got my producer to meet with her and spoke to her. In the first 10 minutes, I said, “The job is yours.” She was like, “What do you mean?” To which I said, “The job is yours. Which role?” And she was like, “What do you mean?” I said, “I’m telling you, you remind me of me when I was a kid, and I did “Summer of Sam.” They’re always going to see you as Connie. You’re always going to be a Connie. I’m giving you the opportunity to be Rose, and I don’t know if you will get that again. I hope you do, but I’m telling you from someone who understands. Maybe look at that.” She would have done a great job but thought the more showy role was Connie.” And listen, she killed it as Connie. And now, looking back, I still think she could do Rose because she’s incredibly talented, but what Emily Bader brings to Rose is incredibly difficult. I don’t think people completely understand how difficult it is what she did, which is to not have these showy scenes like Connie but hold your attention and feel everything she’s feeling in such a profound way. She’s so talented. She was in the “No” pile. She was in like she wasn’t even going to be seen. She didn’t have many credits, but I kept returning to her, thinking, “This kid is blowing me away!” After this movie, she went on to do “My Lady Jane” on Amazon, and now she’s the lead in “People We Meet On Vacation.” Odessa A’zionalso has a show coming out on HBO show coming out, and she’s working with the Safdie Brothers right now. So they did well in this!
What did the cast bring to these characters you lived with for so long? Anything you might not have expected?
Odessa surprised me with a few things. It wasn’t about what she was doing, but her understanding of it in an amazing way. She surprised me with that a few times. And Emily, she truly is the Rose that I saw, which is really saying something that character sat with me for 20 years. It was a role I was going to play way back when, and then I wanted to play Connie because I got older. Eventually, I got to the point where I thought, “If you don’t write this soon, you’re not in it. There’s no grandma!” [laughs] Emily brought a presence to her performance that, as an actor, is so hard. People don’t understand. It’s so hard to be completely present because you have memorized lines, you know? To think like you’re seeing her think from one moment to another is something so captivating and she did it!
We can’t talk about the film without mentioning your role. You’ve, you’ve viewed yourself in all these different positions. What was it like to finally meet her?
It’s so funny because whenever anyone brings me up in the film as an actor, it doesn’t register. It’s odd! [laughs] It just doesn’t register, and it seems like another person, to be honest. In a way, because I’m a mama bear to the whole ship, I’ve been pushing this thing so hard for so long that it feels so separate. It’s also because it was closely based on someone I know. So when I look at myself, I don’t even see myself; I only see her. It’s bizarre. People who know this person say, “Oh, my God! That’s so and so!” And I’m like, “I know, I know! It’s so weird! The mannerisms and everything else, it’s scary almost.
Staten Island plays a huge role in this film. It’s a character in and of itself. How important was that element to the film?
I was told, “Let’s go film in Atlanta. It’s easier money. You get more tax credit.” All this stuff! I was like, “You don’t understand. Staten Island is its own entity. It needs to be on Staten Island. Period. End of story.” You can’t understand unless you come from there or spend some time there. It has its own energy. I made the whole cast stay in Staten Island. They were like, “Umm, Where are we?” I was like, “Hell, baby, Hell!” [laughs[ I’m joking, of course, Staten Island is its own energy, good, bad or indifferent. It has its own feel. So, we just needed to be there. The bakery was the bakery. That house was that house. That house had a sick production designer TV who did an amazing job, but that house was a real house. It’s very stuck in time, Staten Island, for many reasons, and it just needed to be shot there.
So you are back on Staten Island, shooting a period piece centered around the time you grew up. What was it like to dip your toes back into that time period?
Of course, it was! Are you kidding? It was amazing. Also, a big part of it was the music, man! When it came to that, I had so many other songs in there. People kept telling me, “You’re never getting these songs. There’s so much money.” I was like, “Well, I’m gonna try!” But yeah, it was so fun going back to all those songs. I remember hearing the bass from someone’s car coming from blocks away! I was like, “Oh, my God!” Little things like that were really fun to look at again and revisit.
It’s so funny you mentioned the bass. There is a particular scene in the film that showcases that aspect, and it really took me back. You’ll have to throw together a playlist for those tracks!
Done! It’s on Spotify! It’s funny because there are these guys, 80 Empire, who I actually met on Instagram. So when I did get to a place where there were a few songs that I was just not going to get, they really saved the day. They’re musicians, and I said, “Guys, I need three songs that are going to fill in some spots with the sound of that era. They were like, “We’ve got you!” Within 24 hours, they had three songs! I did a verse on one of them! It’s this rap, which is another dream checked off the list because I get to be a rapper for five seconds! [laughs] It was so much fun. These guys are great artists, so that’ll be out soon, too.
That’s awesome! Look at you go! I wanted to talk about a few of the key scenes in the film. It’s such subtle stuff that really stuck with me. Two great examples are Rose under the streetlight and the scene where you focus on the tension of the phone cord as she receives a troubling call.
Yes! That scene in the street under the streetlight was on the chopping block. People were like, “I don’t know. We have to go to another street.” I said, “Listen, I don’t care what you think. This scene is happening. It is so vital.” And, of course, no one gets it until they get it. It is one of my favorite scenes in the movie. It comes again from being an actor and studying at Strasburg, and we used to have these things called “private moments.” It was an exercise where you would do a private moment with a character. I always found it extremely, extremely telling, because there are things that we do in private that we don’t show anyone else. That scene is her moment of freedom, trapped still. I love that scene, and it’s the first scene my editor just casually put together and sent to me. I sobbed my eyes out. I still watch it and sob! It’s just such a powerful scene to me. The scene with the tension and the wire was another thing I was working on with my DP. We went back and forth about what we wanted to do. I thought, “We need a shot of the wire, Just the wire unfolding.” Because to me, I remember those days! You would try to stretch it so far because you didn’t want anyone to hear your conversations. How far can I stretch this wire? I knew that was the shot because it perfectly captures that moment’s tension.
You’ve had a lot of challenges along the way in this film, especially when it comes to promotion and distribution. What are the most significant things you’ve learned there?
I could talk so much about this. I tell you, I keep going back and forth like I want to write a book for everybody, because I didn’t get to go to film school, but man, did I have a master’s degree in this now! Like I said, people always say, “Go make your thing.” Nowadays, you can. We’ve seen Trey Edgar Shultz make “Krisha” for 35 grand is fucking great, so it can be done. It’s the distribution part that we need to figure out. We must figure out how to get to the people without going through the machine. That’s where it breaks down. It’s if you don’t have big names if you don’t have a big distribution company come in, or even these so-called independents, if you don’t have a big producer, you’re just not getting seen. You’re just not getting seen. Don’t tell me it has to be undeniable because that’s not true. I think “Fresh Kills” is undeniable, yet it’s pushed aside. It’s not about me giving myself praise at all. It’s about seeing what’s out there, seeing how people react to this film, and then having to answer the questions repeatedly — “Why didn’t I know about it?” or “Why didn’t I see it?” I can’t answer you because we’re in an industry that values who’s who, money, and business over art. I don’t know, but I do know that if we can figure out how to get to the people without going through the distribution machine, it’d be great. I don’t know what that looks like, but that is where it all breaks down.
Even if you get distribution, if you don’t have hundreds of thousands of dollars for marketing, forget it. Forget it. It’s just not happening. Then, we have award season happening now. The amount of money you need for people just to watch the film is just incredible. I feel like the system is broken for independent films, and I can’t say that the big films they’re making these days are incredible. I’m hoping this is going to push us toward having a resurgence of real independent films again. You know, I came up when independent films were independent films. We made them on the street for nothing and then they went to a film festival which were also real. It was a different thing back then. Now, it’s very corporate, and spaces are for this company or that company. I don’t know where the little film that matters stands or finds a space. I was on the film festival circuit for a year with this film and saw so many wonderful films you’ll never see. And that really sucks. That sucks for all of us.
I know your efforts in promoting this film have been tireless. You’ve been on the front lines, spreading the word every day without fail. That’s pretty inspiring.
Thank you. I’ve tried. It’s tough to keep going, but we still need to raise money for these award show campaigns. I’m just pushing it now because I refuse to go into a black hole. I refuse just to step aside. I’m just going to keep pushing it in your face so you get annoyed. At this point, I’m just “Choke on it!” It’s to that point where this person helping us said, “You know, we may not get a nomination because you need a lot of money.” I said, “I understand, but it’s still going to get the film in front of people who may not know about it.” And for that reason, I’m going to keep going. So I have to make another video soon of something like, “Hey guys! I’m still here talking about “Fresh Kills.” Anybody want to buy a hat?” It’s almost demeaning to some extent, but on the other hand, I feel like I’m speaking not only for other indie filmmakers but also for me as a movie lover. As a kid, I got lost in great movies and things that touch and move us, and audiences are not getting that. They’re not getting to choose, which is a shame to me. That said, I don’t feel like this is just about “Fresh Kills” anymore. I think it’s more about making a stand. Independent films matter. It shouldn’t matter whether or not they have a big star and a lot of money.
You couldn’t be more right. What is the best way for fans of indie films to support a film like yours?
Always tell everybody about the film! “Fresh Kills” has existed on word of mouth. Also, post about it. You can also go to www.arebelliousact.com, which is my website. There is a spot there where you can donate or buy some merch. Everything goes into what I’m doing now. We have one more awards thing to put the movie up for, and it’s, like, $1,200. Then to get it seen is another, couple thousand, and then to have a screening is another couple thousand. People just don’t realize how much goes into getting your film watched by people who vote. It’s just crazy.
If you could go back to the start and give yourself some advice on Day One of this journey, what would it be?
Day one of this experience? Wow! You know, I really don’t know. It’s been really that tough. I don’t know. Would I sit with her and ask, “Are you sure you want to do this?” I think somewhere in me, I knew it would be hard, but I didn’t know what I would experience to this extent. It’s funny because I used to run before I would write. I would run, and then I would box. I felt like I was training for a boxing match or going to war, which is precisely what it felt like! I would probably say, enjoy the small wins more. Enjoy that time on set, which I did, but enjoy it more. The best part of all this was those 20 days, and then you’re fighting for another three years. It was hard, but listen, it’s the most proud I’ve ever been of anything I’ve ever done, and I wouldn’t change that.
This movie should have died 50,000 times for many reasons. I had one producer who got in the hole with me. Whenever I said, “I think I’m going to take up dog grooming or be a real estate person…,” she said, “You can’t do that. You’re not going to do that.” She said, “I promise you it’ll never be as hard as the first one.” And I was like, I don’t know if I believe you. I don’t know if I believe you. That should be the case, but I don’t know!
For what it’s worth, the film couldn’t be any harder-hitting. You fought for every inch, and your journey with the film is going to inspire someone. Don’t forget that!
Thank you, that is true! I get that a lot from many different people, so I appreciate that. It’s good to be reminded of that every so often because when it gets, that’s easy to forget, but thank you. I appreciate it.
What do you think the future holds for you?
I really enjoy teaching, and I’ve been doing that for a couple of years. It actually saves my mind. I also have a few things that I’m working on and writing. My managers are like, “Are you done?” And I’m like, “Nope, I’m not even close.” I say that because this has taken all my time, and I’m extremely bruised. So I find it hard because you get in your head, and it becomes, “Why am I doing this?” Then I heard Rick Rubin, the producer, say that amazing thing. He’s like, “It’s not for anybody. It’s for you. If the audience happens to like it, and if it gets to an audience, great. But it’s not for anybody. It’s a diary entry.” That connected with me because with “Fresh Kills,” I wrote it for the 26-year-old kid who got screwed up in this business. I wrote it for me. So now, this other thing that’s been weighing on me to write is that I have to write it myself. That’s it. If it goes somewhere, great. If it doesn’t, it doesn’t. I am also attached to direct something that the writer of “To Leslie” wrote. His name is Ryan Bianco, and he is a great writer. It’s a great script, so we’re waiting to see if we can get a certain female who brings money back in the same spot! Hopefully, that’ll happen because I’d love to direct this piece. It’s really good. Then, yeah, I want to get my stuff out there one day, but it may take a minute.
Jennifer, I can’t thank you enough for speaking with us today. You’ve been more than gracious with your time. You, indeed, are an inspiration. Keep the good stuff coming!
Thank you so much, Jason! It’s been a pleasure. Take care, and I’ll talk to you soon.
Jennifer Esposito’s ‘Fresh Kills’ is available now. Swing by the official website of the film at www.freshkillsmovie.com for more info or to help support this amazing film! Most importantly, follow Jennifer’s continuing adventures through social media via IG and X.
Jason Price founded the mighty Icon Vs. Icon more than a decade ago. Along the way, he’s assembled an amazing group of like-minded individuals to spread the word on some of the most unique people and projects on the pop culture landscape.
